Could somebody post a beginner's guide to what exactly a Brodie helmet is, if there was any other type of British helmet in WWI, and how they differed from WW2? The shape of the shell tells me its WWI manufacter.
Tell me what I have, Brodie Helmet identification request. He worked at the Houses of Parliament (I cant quite remember what position he held but I will ask my step father tomorrow) and he was good friends with Sir Winston Churchill and attended various dinners with him, one of which we have the original letter and menu for. We offer a 100% return policy. of a WW1 helmet this normally means it's milder steel used and not for combat use.
Firth & Sons. While the basic structure of the M1 remained relatively unchanged in the years that followed, the liner went through many different designs. I'm putting in a picture. on the American helmets they look very crudely overlapped. John Brodie designed the 'tin helmet' as worn in WW1, hence its name. dailyinfo[23]='
9656 Private Isaac COOPER "A" Coy. WW2 British Army Staff Officers Cap and Collar Tabs. Some developed nations such as Australia and Canada even continued to use it well into the 1990s. British Mark Mark I Brodie U.S. P17 helmet The most obvious difference may be observed by turning the helmet over. $150-300 Information & Special Terms Internet Premium : 20% Participation Requirements: Valid Credit Card required for bidding approval Payment Options: Visa, MasterCard, Discover, American Express, Check, Money Order, Wire Transfer, and Cash Visa MasterCard Discover American Express Payment Instructions . Bluecher German Navy who died 29/01/1915 CANNOCK CHASE GERMAN MILITARY CEMETERY United Kingdom '
I guess my difficulty is that discussions about brodies are quite detailed and assume prior knowledge.
The British Mark I has a rubber ring sometimes called adoughnut sewn between two pieces of wool in the base of the helmet dome. I bought aBrodie helmet and I'm not sure from witch war or time the helmet is from. dailyinfo[2]='
8020 Serjeant Charles POOLE "C" Coy. A British Brodie 'Tommy' steel helmet with net and leather lining. During the war, the Company took part in fire watching duties, manned a gun at the exit to Westminster Underground Station and undertook a wide variety of training schemes. The doughnut was added for the wearers comfort. We live day by day, and I always say: yesterday is history, today's reality, and tomorrow's a dream.' Manufacturing Co - Philadelphia - Pennsylvania.
1st Bn. McCord Radiator, Ford Motor Company were both known to have made P17s, but there wereundoubtedly more. Helmet, Belgian Though, my opinion is that the helmet is an American M1917. 2nd Bn. colour is the paint finish of the helmet, in the photo it looks blue/grey ?. You cannot paste images directly. Very Solid condition. You can post now and register later. Unfortunately the helmet was in a shed for many years so is quite rusted. And this only accounts for its use by the American military. in the late 1930s - 1941 and the M1 helmet and liner was phased in 1941 - 1942. Incredibly, given that the M1 was being used by some advanced militaries as recently as the 1990s and is still employed by a few countries today, the development of it dates back to the First World War in the mid-1910s. sizes 54cm to 62cm. Mar 18, 2023 (2) WWI US ARMY DOUGHBOY COMBAT HELMETS $50. View detail. June 9, 2018 in WW2 British Army MkII Brodie Helmet MkI Liner - 1939, MKII Chinstrap arrived in France in 1917 wearing wool campaign hats, which would have beenunsuitablefor trench combat. http://www.cefresearch.com/phpBB2/index.php, Here is a reply from Roger Lucy, who wrote the book TIN LIDS, "In his article on the Mk.I in Militaria # 6, July, 1994, the British helmet guru, Marcus Cotton, suggests that FKS probably stands for Thos. Helmets and Headgear, Shortly after the US declaration of war in April of 1917 the US ordered around 400,000 helmets from the British for use by, the American Expeditionary Force. Tell me what I have, Brodie Helmet identification request. before , possibly made by oneof the allied countries. The color of paint used by both the British and American manufactures do show some similarity. H.M.S. The helmet was basically an inverted bowl stamped out of a single piece of manganese alloy, which was made up of 13 percent manganese and was .036" thick. Hi! Meccano
MILITARIA COLLECTING Want to read more? The shape of the helmet was also somewhat similar to the Brodie in that it was based around a circular steel cap which provided maximum protection to the top of the head, with the rim protecting the ears and upper face. View detail. dailyinfo[18]=' 6422 Private Charlie GILBERT 4th Coy. By holding a British shell in one hand and an American shell in the other the weight difference is obvious. Tom.Delahoyde Hello Gents, it's been a long time, but I am back with an ID request. depaor014 January , 2013 in Uniforms,Cap Badges and Insignia. Thus, in one guise or another it shaped the design of military helmets all over the world for much of the twentieth century. The M1 came in two parts, a hard metal shell or cap on the outside, and an inner liner hat made out of softer and more malleable materials. accross the pond,? E.G.Budd. We are born to die, but I appreciate life. English: The "Brodie" shrapnel helmet was the flat steel helmet worn by British Empire troops in the first and second world wars, and U.S. troops in World War I. U.S. M2 82nd Airborne Pathfinder Camo. Often American GIs used the steel cap from the M1 as a rudimentary entrenching tool to dig these foxholes. The buckle and loop clamps of the initial issue of this chinstrap were painted green. WW2 British Army Staff Officers Cap and Collar Tabs Royal Warwickshire Regiment who died 12/03/1918 ST. The doughnut was added for the wearers comfort. It may have been refurbished by the Americans during the 1930s and had new mounts added, which they did to both British and American Helmets, if you can find a makers mark you will know for sure. He was in standard active service but was injured in 1941/42 and it was then when he was positioned at Parliament. dailyinfo[26]=' Chaplain 4th Class The Rev. var day=mydate.getDay()
With 'COMET ABL 56' printed inside. 1st Bn. else { document.write(fontstart+"No major events today"+fontend); }
I already have two others. The final push in using the Brodie was a variant which was produced in 1936 and which saw widespread service by the Norwegians during the German invasion of their country in the spring of 1940 and by the British Expeditionary Force in France several weeks later. H.M.S. dailyinfo[18]=' 6422 Private Charlie GILBERT 4th Coy. Steel Helmet | International Encyclopedia of the First World War (WW1) Hi Tom, it looks to me like it might be a Home Guard helmet but I will let Colin give his opinion first. Sorry for the long post and thanks for any info you can give me. dailyinfo[17]=' PLY/3566 Private Samuel ROBINSON H.M.S. The helmet is an American M1917 made for the American Expeditionary Force, but very few made it to, The stamp mark on the helmet looks like ZC 3 which is thought to belong to the Edward. Share 9 posts Mariner109 16 Gefreiter Mar 27, 2010 #1 My buddy has a Brodie Helmet which he might be offering for sale. Royal Engineers who died 31/01/1919 COLOGNE SOUTHERN CEMETERY Germany '
Ones with three holes drilled over the ears on each side didn't pass quality . dailyinfo[17]=' PLY/3566 Private Samuel ROBINSON H.M.S. U.S. P17 chinstrap bail dailyinfo[25]=' 262952 Private Archibald Stanley BURGNEAY 8th Bn. I always liked the Brodie Helmet, sure as protective as other helmets of the era but a neat helmet. The helmet was rimless and was painted a smooth dark-green color. The bail holder is secured to the helmets skirt with a steel harness rivet. Colloquially, it was also called the shrapnel helmet or Tommy helmet, and in the United States known as a doughboy helmet. Inland = Inland Manufacturing Co ( General Motors ) - Ohio. Known M1917 Helmet Liner Manufacturers Stamp Marks. http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675048436_military-helmets_assembling-helmets_dipping-into-paint-tanks_wooden-crates. It was made of 'Hadfield steel', which could withstand the impact of some shrapnel. I now think the 3 letters on the fromt is actually D then a Crown then the letter H. Also after cleaning the helmet i have found the liner manufacturers: Vero 2 = Everett.W.Vero & Co London.1937 - 1944, Very interesting Tom, if it is a crown then the letters could stand for Department Head to show he was the top. var day=mydate.getDay()
dailyinfo[28]=' 19673 Leading Aircraftman Samuel Ambrose TICKNER Meritorious Service Medal No. This difference along is enough identify the origin of the helmet. "Orbita." Sparks Withington Co - Jackson - Michigan. "We Cannot Always Buy What We Want, But We Buy What We Can". The codeusuallystarts with a Z and is followedby a series of numbers. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. The Brodie helmet was designed by John Leopold Brodie, a Lithuanian entrepreneur and inventor who had first made his fortune working the gold and diamond mines of South Africa in the 1890s and 1900s and had then moved to Britain.
Paste as plain text instead, dailyinfo[4]=' Matrose Paul KURZKE Torpedoboot "G85" German Navy who died 04/03/1919 CANNOCK CHASE GERMAN MILITARY CEMETERY United Kingdom '
Both helmet have a similar dome and similar skirt. While they were initially produced from manufactured paper fibres, these models were quickly discontinued when it was realised that they degraded in short order, particularly in the tropical conditions of the Pacific War in 1942 and 1943. dailyinfo[30]=' B/469 Worker Charles BARLOW Australian Munition Worker who died 30/01/1918 NORTH SHEEN CEMETERY United Kingdom '
Highland Light Infantry who died 19/03/1915 LE TOURET MEMORIAL France '
A desirable unit marked helmet can go for around $500.00. I would say the paintwork on your helmet is original. I bought it in France and I really don't know what kind of brodie is it and which army used it. U.S. M2 Pathfinder camo was particularly favored by members of the 82nd. dailyinfo[10]=' 14780 Member Ida Styles HUGHES (Oxford) Womens Royal Air Force who died 10/03/1919 OXFORD (ROSE HILL) CEMETERY United Kingdom '
He said it has a separate rim and a serial number of ZA57. The bail holder is secured to the helmets skirt by way of a steel split rivet. 1999-11-70-31 The Brodie design featured a brim 2in (5cm) wide, which protected the head and shoulders from above. Pasted as rich text. The British cleverly dealt with this problem by issuing their men with a Hessian cloth cover. dailyinfo[27]=' 5778 Private William CUMMINGS 6th Bn. Clear editor. dailyinfo[19]=' 9228 Corporal George F. PARRY 2nd Bn. It wasundoubtedly a welcomerelief from having the helmet constantly bounce up and down on the top of the wearer skull while running across no mans land. Those U.S. forces that worked with the French Army wore the Adrian Helmet. 5th Bde. G. Budd Manufacturing Co. ), ( ZJ- Marks belong to Columbian Enamelling & Stamping Co. ). : Brodie helmets. In the years after the end of the war the American Infantry Board tested a number of new models, but each of these were deemed to not mark any real improvement on the earlier design. Yet its use did not stop there. What pattern of helmet is this, and given the unusual markings, is it a valuable relic, or is it some fantasy piece suitable to be stripped and restored to issue green? WW1 Brodie Helmet - Fallout 4 Mod Requests - The Nexus Forums Itsin rough shape and I have yet to find a manufacture/heat stamp. Palace of Westminster Home Guard cap badge. BlackWatch 5 years ago. And later the Germans. It was superseded by the Personnel Armor System for Ground Troops or PASGT, a combination type of armour consisting of a ballistics vest and a combat helmet. You can contact the auctioneer on +353 1 282 6107 for more information. You cannot paste images directly. What are the chances that the Big Red One emblem is original? More innovatively the steel cap was also used as a multi-purpose device by American soldiers during the Second World War. I believe they were numbered 1-24. Looks like an original Mk2 shell, obviously repainted. First thing is to see if you can figure out the unit emblem on the helmet. Available on our website now, Danish m23. stepback_antiques 12 years ago. ( ZA-Marks belong to the Crosby Manufacturing Co. ), ( ZB-Marks are thought to belong to the Worchester Pressed Steel Co. ), ( ZC-Marks belong to Edward. Northamptonshire Regiment who died 14/03/1915 LE TOURET MEMORIAL France '
WW1 Canadian British CEF BEF Brodie Helmet & Liner. Colloquially, it was called the shrapnel helmet, battle bowler, Tommy helmet, tin hat, and in the United States the doughboy helmet. The British bail design proved to be too weak for the rigors of the trenches. Early Mark I helmet initially had thisfeature only to be discontinue in mid 1916. the problem is that, all the war time services such as the ARP, NFS, and various Civil Defence Units as well as the Home Guard all were. "Orbita." brodie helmet products for sale | eBay 6 Reserve Lorry Park Royal Air Force who died 28/02/1919 BELGRADE CEMETERY Belgium '
Military Helmet Identification and Price Guide - MilitaryItems.com
FOR SALE! This style of helmet had been in use since the 1st World War and was often colloquially known as the Tommy helmet in the UK or as the Doughboy helmet in the US. Powered by Invision Community, Brodie Steel trench helmet Identification marks, Upcoming changes to logging in - click here, GWF is free to use so please support the Forum. View detail. Reproduction WW2 British Army Brodie Helmet with Chinstrap - Tommy Powered by Invision Community, (In no particular order)
Danish m23. With New Vegas, I luckily was able to use the NCR Trooper Helmet, but there is no helmet like that in this game. Your link has been automatically embedded. It does not have that stamp so it is probably one from world war 2 then. brodie helmet All Auction Buy it now 386 results Service Type Country/ Organization Era Issued/ Not-Issued Condition Price Buying format All filters WW 2 BRODIE NFS Helmet 1940. I have had a good look at your helmet again and managed to find another one to compare,This is an American, Here is a British made helmet from the same period, look at the rim joint how clean the joint is put together, now take a look at the rim joints. It's definitely a British Mk I helmet. Columbian Enameling & Stamping Co - Terre Haute - Indiana. G. Budd, Manufacturing Co. WW1 US AEF Unit Flashed Brodie Combat Helmet & Liner Similarly other late entrants into the war such as Portugal relied on supplies of the Brodie to protect the heads of their troops. All orders are shipped the same day from within the USA. I find the M1 an excellent helmet when properly adjusted. Wwi Italian Army M1915 Adrian Combat Helmet The shell is an American made M1917A1 made by the ( McCord Radiator Co ) the heat stamp number( 10C ). Middlesex Regiment who died 25/02/1921 LADYWELL CEMETERY United Kingdom '
dailyinfo[29]=' Oberleutnant zur See Axel Carl Ludwig VON SCHOENERMARCK S.M.S. The PASGT helmet was a new generation of combat helmet, being made from nineteen layers of Kevlar, a light-weight synthetic fibre material which offered higher levels of protection than the manganese-steel alloy from which the M1s had been manufactured. dailyinfo[20]=' 10259 Private Charles BUCHANAN 1st Bn. The story, for many years I wanted a bog standard WW2 Cdn pattern helmet for my collection, mainly a display piece. The design was esentially the same in WW2, but there are a number of specific differences between the two and once you recognise these differences, such as the width of the brim (wider in WW1), you find you can tell one from another very easily. if (month<10) month="0"+month
By Parrotman287 1 year ago. Clment.
The finalised model which went into mass production using Hadfield Steel from late 1915 onwards weighed 2.4 pounds or 1.1. kgs. Helmet M-1917 dailyinfo[5]=' 12147 Private Harry COOK 8th Bn. In addition, the heads of soldiers had relatively greater exposure than other body areas above the parapets in the European trench warfare of that period, and the British "Brodie" helmet and the nearly identical U.S. Marine Corps Doughboy helmet gave insufficient protection to the back of the skull (in contrast to the protection afforded by . dailyinfo[5]=' 12147 Private Harry COOK 8th Bn. Do you know if he wasa civilian at this time, and could you take a photo of the inside of the helmet for me, and what. I'll ask about the bail rivets. America ended up purchasing roughly 400,000 Brodie helmets from the British and produced over 2,700,000 M1917 helmets by the war's end. In the case of the British Mark I there is typically a letter followed by a slash followed by another letter.
= International Molded Plastics - Massachusetts. These heavy finishes were field or depot applied. Heres a photo of a little of the remaining paint, it seems dark grey/green to me, and a photo of the inside. For slow learners: A Brodie is simply the design of British Army helmet worn in both WWI and WW2, and not a particular type of WWI helmet? By DizzyDeano96 12 months ago. It it worth noting that while British servicemen were never issued with American helmets, American service men were issued British helmets. Paste as plain text instead, var daym=mydate.getDate()
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Thank you for your reply. Is it a BEF or US helmet? Related Weapons & Armor. I've just been given what looks like a pretty standard "Tommy" helmet.
New Zealand Engineers who died 13/03/1918 ST. POL COMMUNAL CEMETERY EXTENSION France '
Although a few American troops did manage to get a hold of covers by in large the A.E.F. 25.00 1 bid 5.35 postage 5d 19h Click & Collect Repro British Army WW2 Plastic Helmet Tommy Doughboy Brodie Style WWII Soldier 12.99 Click & Collect Free postage Accordingly, the American government purchased hundreds of thousands of Brodie helmets from the British as a stop-gap measure. 354.85 Buy It Now. The American manufactures used an entirely different method to apply the paint to the helmets. Its service history within the US armed forces spans a period of over forty years, being the standard issue military headgear for American soldiers between 1941 and 1983 and inspiring imitation models around the world. So. The American shell is heavier. By Willow1 3 years ago. What mythical beast could that be?? Seaforth Highlanders who died 20/03/1919 BEIRUT WAR CEMETERY Lebanese Republic '
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There are some small differences though, one being British chinstrap have stamped steel or brass slide buckles while the Americans favored cast steel slide buckles. 100% refund policy on all items returned within 30 days. Benjamin Electric Co - Des Plaines - Illinois. The Brodie has been described by the Imperial War Museum as "a masterpiece of simple design", while militaria expert Martin Pegler calls it "the most instantly recognisable symbol of the British Tommy", although most troops would not have referred to it by by the same name. I really don't think there are any other markings. The M1 offered exceptional protection. Copyright Treasure Bunker Ltd A heat stamp of 305B on a McCord manufactured helmet. to attach them. In August 1915 he acquired a patent for a steel helmet design of his own, one which could be produced from a single sheet of steel pressed into the first basic Brodie helmet. When the helmets are viewed side by side it is easy to see why so many people confuse one for the other. While British and American helmets may be painted similar colors the finishes on the two type of helmet differ. lol. The colour is fine looks to be the factory green finish, you can buy second hand original liners on line as long as it is for the MkII helmet. It is unknown what is any maker marks these companies used. Thanks for these pictures! M1 Helmet Identification; Shipping; Sizing; 1-877-862-5245; TOP POTS - DEDICATED TO M-1 HELMET PRESERVATION. Probably the most recognised piece of kit from the Second World War is the British tin helmet which was also used in a variety of forms on the Home Front. helmets which have a wide range of different paint colours and textures, most of these new helmetswere made in early 1941. dailyinfo[12]=' 457 Lance Corporal Arthur Price ROWE 2nd/7th Bn. Royal Air Force who died 24/02/1919 LINCOLN (NEWPORT) CEMETERY United Kingdom '
So a large number of Americandough boyswore British made helmets though out their service in France. Hi J.H.E. There should not be a threaded nut. dailyinfo[15]=' SS/342 Able Seaman Henry George SMITH (RFR/CH/B/5534).
This used brass case is approximately 75 mm diameter and is marked with a 1916 manufacturing date. I suppose your cousins in the US would call it Tommy helmet the Germans went for salad bowl. $3,000. Helmet Gallery - Alexander and Sons German Helmet Restoration Significantly, over 400,000 Brodies were sold to the United States for use in France after they joined the war in April 1917. WW1 British Brodie Helmet recovered from the SOMME. By 1916, Brodie helmet . Classic cars
The helmet came without the liner and the onlymark in the helmet is 4B and I don't know why but under every scratch looks red maybe the helmet was red. Canada's Brodie Seger, left, signs a fans helmet after the men's World External view of a Helmet, Steel, Mark I. RELAWM01013 Internal view of a Helmet, Steel, Mark I. RELAWM01013 I'm thinking the lettering could refer to a department he possibly. You can post now and register later. Military Helmet Price Guide - MilitaryItems.com Was the safety of a WW1 helmet called into question because